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Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation time
Last Activity 11/30/2022 4:49 PM
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Roland van Giesen

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Subject : Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation time
Posted : 10/27/2020 8:33 PM
Post #31273

I recently purchased a new desktop with hardware selected to make quick calculations with Omnitrader Strategy Wizard or other software from Nirvana such as Genetic Algo's. I have chosen a computing power modified 4K Video Processing PC with an AMD processor to get the price 250$ lower compared to an equivalent Intel processor.
To see what the difference was between the old and new desktop, I tested the Strategy Wizard based on a somewhat older and GA modified Nirvana TLB2 Power Strategy.
With the Strategy Wizard I optimized this strategy on 4 of the 16 systems in the system block, resulting in 324 permutations. The test was plotted on the entire S&P 100, with 1500 days back test and 500 days forward test.
My old computer has an AMD A8 6600K Quad core 3.9 GHz processor, 32 GB DDR3 memory and a 1TB SSD with SATA connection.
The new desktop has an AMD Ryzen 9 3900X, 12 cores, 3.9 GHz processor, 32 GB DDR4 memory, motherboard MSI MPG X570 Gaming Edge Wifi, 1TB SSD M.2 connection and 600W power supply.
Both PC's run Windows 10 PRO.
The result of the test is as follows:
The old PC took 2673 minutes to calculate the whole (or 44 hours and 33 minutes).
The new PC needed 357 minutes (or 5 hours and 57 minutes).
This makes the new PC 7.5 times faster than the old one.
I hope this gives good information for those who are wondering which computer choice can help reduce OT computing time.



[Edited by Roland van Giesen on 10/28/2020 12:58 PM]

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james

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 10/27/2020 9:09 PM
Post #31274 - In reply to #31273

Good info Roland
What sort of $$ are we talking about?

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Roland van Giesen

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 10/28/2020 12:23 PM
Post #31275 - In reply to #31274

Hi James, Google showed several sites where to buy it in USA and I found almost a copy of the one I have at https://www.officedepot.com/a/products/7911364/CybertronPC-CLX-SET-TGMSETRTH9A23BM-MDT-Ryzen/


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mgerber

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 10/28/2020 6:31 PM
Post #31276 - In reply to #31275

Hi, Roland.

I am currently designing a new computer build for next month (Nov), so I have a special interest in your reporting.

A Strategy Wizard improvement factor of 7.5 is very significant (!!). To what degree do you think the various new components contribute to this huge performance boost?

--From what I have heard discussed elsewhere, I would not think that the SATA to NVMe would contribute much, except for initial program loading.
(EDIT: Corrected the reference to M.2 which is just a form factor)

--Strat Wiz works in memory, so one of the biggest boosters would definitely be DDR3 to DDR4, and also the higher frequency of the newer DDR4.

--The core speeds are the same 3.9GHz, but the newer cpu instruction throughput is probably significantly higher. Q: I do not think that Strat wiz can use more than one core; OT/VT do not. But GA training is supposed to be multi-core (4 to 12 cores!). (EDIT: Barry Cohen confirmed in separate email that Strat Wiz can only use one core).

--The move from PCI 3 to PCI 4 (X570 mobo) might be helpful; not sure how, though. Only NVMe would use the PCIe for Strat Wiz purposes; for data logging?

Anybody have ideas/suggestions?

What do you think Roland?


--Mark G.





[Edited by mgerber on 10/29/2020 8:42 PM]

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Roland van Giesen

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 10/28/2020 7:46 PM
Post #31277 - In reply to #31276

Hi Mark, I'm not an ICT specialist at all, so I started asking Nirvana for advice on what they thought GA and StratWiz really needed in terms of hardware. After 2 emails without any answer I gave up and started calling three small companies that build custom made computers. I explained to them exactly what I needed the hardware for and what I wanted to achieve compared to the current situation. The advice from all parties was fairly unanimous, namely that I had to have a powerful processor with at least 8 and preferably more cores, high speed, preferably overclocked. 32Gb RAM DDR4 was sufficient, certainly compared to what I had. 64 GB was better, but price performance wise too expensive compared to the speed difference of 32 GB in the proposed setting. A high cpu throughput was also necessary to handle high speed.The SSD M2 is fantastic in terms of startup speed and everything to do with data storage, but I don't think it should really contribute to the computing speed, at least if OT from its software configuration doesn't always return to information stored during computing. As far as the latter is concerned, I'm not so sure afterwards, because the replacement of a HDD to an SSD sata on the old PC certainly brought an improvement in calculation time, but I can't substantiate this with measurements. I hope this confirmed your thoughts for a good computer design.
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THOMAS HELGET

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 10/30/2020 4:00 PM
Post #31279 - In reply to #31277

Guys:

I too am not a computer specialist but over a year ago I bought a laptop from Eddie Z that was clocked at roughly half the speed of what I am going to show below (Benchmark 17000):




I have to say that it is so quick at times that I can't keep up with it! Startup is almost instantaneous and installation of programs will knock your socks off. Mine has a 1 TB SSD and 32 GB of RAM but no 2 TB Backup HD. It also has a 17.3" screen (not available here). Worse yet I paid $500 more for it at the time (includes NYS tax).

I should also say that Eddie Z has a comparable Desktop called The Dominator at a comparable low price:



Now sad to say the sale on the Odyssey just ended this week.

But if you are interested in either of these keep an eye out as the Z man runs specials every week and I wouldn't be surprised if in a couple of weeks the Dominator is back on sale.

Hope that helps, and, no, I am not paid for these endorsements - just a happy camper with my purchase,

Tom Helget

[Edited by THOMAS HELGET on 10/30/2020 4:11 PM]

Attached file : Eddie Z The Odyssey X1 15.6 Inch EZ Trading Laptop.jpg (141KB - 948 downloads)
Attached file : Eddie Z The Dominator XE EZ Trading Computer Oct 12.jpg (172KB - 865 downloads)

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Duxx

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 1/1/2022 10:34 PM
Post #31771 - In reply to #31279

Tom Happy New Year. Best wishes for 2022

Question: Are you still happy with your buy? Anything you would change?

Thanks
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THOMAS HELGET

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 1/2/2022 7:38 AM
Post #31774 - In reply to #31771

Duxx:

Yes, I am very happy with my purchase of a laptop from Eddie Z. I have had it over a year now and it is the fastest computer I currently have.

However, the newer models are even better.

Here is the most recent desktop model he has had on sale:



Note that it would be best to be on his mailing list to be advised of the sale of the week.

Tom Helget

[Edited by THOMAS HELGET on 1/2/2022 7:43 AM]

Attached file : Eddie Z The Dominator XE EZ Trading Computer December 27, 2021.jpg (174KB - 507 downloads)

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Duxx

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 1/2/2022 7:42 AM
Post #31775 - In reply to #31774

Thank you Tom. Will
Get to their mailing list for their laptops

Thank you again
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THOMAS HELGET

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 1/2/2022 7:44 AM
Post #31776 - In reply to #31775

Duxx:

Sorry I can't get the image in my email above to display. The laptops are usually around half the speed of the desktops but still are much faster than any other laptops you might find in the general market.

Tom

[Edited by THOMAS HELGET on 1/2/2022 7:45 AM]

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Frank Birch

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 1/3/2022 3:58 PM
Post #31784 - In reply to #31776

Hi to all,
Or a 64bit program could help?

Regards

Frank Birch
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Boris Lund

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 1/3/2022 4:29 PM
Post #31785 - In reply to #31273

I will share my findings regarding maximum performance for OT.
It does not really support multicores so a giant multicore system is out of the question. But it does support dual core at least for the ARM training.
I have both AMD 5800x and 5950x and they are performing equally despite the superior multicore performance from the 5950x.
The most performance gain I got was from loading the whole program onto a 12GB ramdisk.
For those interested in ARM training there is a giant bottleneck from writing to the arm file. The more rules it finds the more it writes to the file. Moving everything into ram I got a performance gain of 50%. Even from having the fastest SSD possible.
Unfortunately nothing in OT benefits from more than two cores so buy the best singlecore performing system and load it onto a ramdrive. On https://www.cpubenchmark.net/singleThread.html I can see the I9 12900KF is at top right now. But that is only 20% faster than what I got, while utilizing multicores would likely speed it 500% up.
We all wish for true multicore utilization in OT. Even I am not training ARM, I am optimizing a lot to find the optimal strategy settings with the optimal stops.
If that happy day should arrive then we have AMD Threadripper 3995wx on the table, or even the possibility of rented cpu space since that is about scaling cores but it hits the treshold very fast with singlecore performance.
What else apart from ARM could benefit from multicore support is ofc. the optimization but also the strategy scan. It would be awesome if it could grab 10 symbols at a time and parallel process them.

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Frank Birch

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 1/3/2022 4:44 PM
Post #31786 - In reply to #31785

Hi Boris & all,

I have found to keep the list short so you can increase the back test period.
There is many set ups where you can use optimization (be it dynamic) and even strategy wizard to our advantage.
So I get that your on the course of finding the most powerful PC to help in our Quest for perfection.
I personally buy the best every year to keep up to date as machines run faster that road runner these days.
The list I use is the Forex 6 majors as there is a natural ebb and flow to the market (24 hours) which helps all systems.

Regards

Frank Birch
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Roland van Giesen

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 1/4/2022 1:13 PM
Post #31795 - In reply to #31786

Hi Frank & all , I'm in the process of buying another new trading desktop and reminded this posting here on the subject. Is there any updated recommendation from your side regarding an ultrafast trading desktop like the Dominator as mentioned in the posts before?
Might also be of interest to you that a "clone" of the Dominator desktop, based on AMD Ryzen 9 5900X - 12 Cores, bought today outside US (NL) is priced: $ 1880, incl VAT, excl shipment to USA


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aztrix

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 8/27/2022 2:57 AM
Post #32073 - In reply to #31785

Hi Boris

I'm looking to setup my trading apps on a RAM Disk/Drive and I see you are doing this, would you mind sharing your experiences, advice, challenges, pros, cons, etc.?

Cheers
Aztrix

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james

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 11/16/2022 12:31 PM
Post #32110 - In reply to #32073

My present laptop can no longer keep up with GA and NN training, ARM and ATM testing.
Ed Z is offering the laptop (see attachment) which seems to me cabable of doing the job but I really have no idea.
Any comments as to its' viability would be deeply appreciated

James
Attached file : EZ.png (135KB - 23 downloads)

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THOMAS HELGET

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 11/16/2022 1:18 PM
Post #32111 - In reply to #32110

James:

Ha, I haven't received any Sale Promos from Eddie Z for quite a while now - I thought that the microprocessor chip shortage had maybe caused him supply chain problems.

If you look above at Post 31279 I show a laptop that I remarked was much faster than the one I obtained way back in 2019. My Eddie Z computer would also be much slower than the one you show in your screen shot. However, my RAM is 32.0 GB and I have a 1 TB Solid State drive. Keep that in mind regarding my comments below.

I have to say that my Eddie Z Laptop works like I have always wanted a computer to perform. It is the first to complete any Windows Updates - while my other (older computers) are still downloading I am already logged in to that Windows Updated Voyager-Z370 Laptop. Also, it runs identical programs on all my computers much faster. However, even with the 32.0 GB you have to be careful running Strategy Wizards. I would suggest you keep your number of permutations to below 500 or you might run out of memory. This might be an OT issue (memory leak), but I don't honestly know. As far as GA and NN Training - I really hardly ever do that so I can't really comment.

So, I think the microprocessor of the laptop you are considering should be just fine. However, you might want to consider pricing a RAM upgrade (just talk with an Eddie Z Rep - my laptop RAM is an upgrade). Whether or not a larger Solid-State Drive might be of any value I really don't know - if you are only running OT (VT) and a few other programs the 250 GB might be just fine - but make sure it is Solid State and not a conventional hard drive. Also note that I paid something like $2200 for my laptop way back in 2019 and so even if your new one cost you that considering inflation it would a fair bargain in my opinion.

I hope that helps and I sure hope that if any more computer savvy OT user has any comments, they will chime in.

Good luck,

Tom Helget
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james

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 11/17/2022 12:22 PM
Post #32112 - In reply to #32111

Hi Tom,

Thanks for the good advice. I learnt quite a bit from you and the other posts on this site.
So I will talk to the folks at EZ .. and inquire about upgrades

Best

James
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THOMAS HELGET

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 11/17/2022 12:34 PM
Post #32113 - In reply to #32112

James:

You're welcome!

I think you can see that I am happy with my purchase and that I consider the computer you are considering to be even better.

Once again, the only changes I might consider would be more RAM and maybe a bit larger SSD if you think you might be running more programs so that you have enough storage space. Although I have a 1 TB SSD only 25% of that is taken up with programs and data running Windows 10. The other programs are several past versions of OT and VT, Microsoft Office, and a few other financial programs. But note that this would pretty much fill up your 250 GB SSD. That will slow things down and so I would recommend at least a 500 GB SSD in your case.

Good luck!

Tom
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Mel

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 11/29/2022 12:51 PM
Post #32116 - In reply to #32113

My current machine is custom made by Xidax. When you talk to their sailsmen, you are talking to highly competant folks who listen to your requirements and configure a machine in your budget range. Mine was no much more expensive thatn commercially available ones, is completely silent, runs cool, and is very fast. Check them out when you look for a machine. Most custom manufactuers cater to gamers, Xidax also does business machine well.

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THOMAS HELGET

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 11/29/2022 12:58 PM
Post #32117 - In reply to #32116

Mel:

Thanks for that information!

Might you be able to comment more specifically on your CPU, RAM and Hard/Solid State Drive specifications?

Thanks,

Tom Helget
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Mel

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 11/29/2022 1:21 PM
Post #32118 - In reply to #32117

Windows 11 Home 64-bit
CPU
Intel Core i7 10700K @ 3.80GHz 35 °C
Comet Lake 14nm Technology
RAM
32.0GB Dual-Channel DDR4 @ 1599MHz (16-18-18-38)
Motherboard
Micro-Star International Co. Ltd. MEG Z590 ACE (MS-7D04) (U3E1)
Graphics
VX2770 SERIESY"ñO# ƒ (1920x1080@60Hz)
DELL U2412M (1200x1920@59Hz)
1023MB NVIDIA GeForce GT 710 (MSI) 43 °C
Storage
931GB Western Digital WDC WDS100T2B0A-00SM50 (SATA (SSD)) 30 °C
931GB Western Digital WDS100T3X0C-00SJG0 (Unknown (SSD))
Optical Drives
ATA DRW-24F1ST d
Audio
NVIDIA Virtual Audio Device (Wave Extensible) (WDM)
Motherboard
Manufacturer Micro-Star International Co. Ltd.
Model MEG Z590 ACE (MS-7D04) (U3E1)
Version 1.0
Chipset Vendor Intel
Chipset Model Comet Lake
Chipset Revision 05
Southbridge Vendor Intel
Memory
Type DDR4
Size 32666 MBytes
Channels # Dual
DRAM Frequency 1599.3 MHz
CAS# Latency (CL) 16 clocks
RAS# to CAS# Delay (tRCD) 18 clocks
RAS# Precharge (tRP) 18 clocks
Cycle Time (tRAS) 38 clocks
Command Rate (CR) 2T
Physical Memory
Memory Usage 29 %
Total Physical 32 GB
Available Physical 23 GB
Total Virtual 34 GB
Available Virtual 24 GB
SPD
Number Of SPD Modules 0 Southbridge Model ID4385


Southbridge Revision 11

Awesome fans, cooling, power supply, and case with see thru side. All cables dressed, no wires except in dressed bundles. Room for expansion.

One SSD is super fast, has OS and programs. Other is fast, for data. Use usb backup with hard disks, no actural HD in machine

Mel


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THOMAS HELGET

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 11/29/2022 1:38 PM
Post #32119 - In reply to #32118

Mel:

Thanks - that confirms what I thought you might say.

Basically, a fast (3.8GHz) microprocessor with 32GB of DDR4 RAM and a 1TB Standard Hard Drive and a 1TB SSD.

It's much like my laptop, but alternatively I have a 3.6 GHz microprocessor (Intel Core i7-9700KF) and only the 1TB SSD.

I hope that helps James get a clearer picture of what might work wll for him and what he might benefit from.

Tom Helget
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james

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 11/30/2022 12:34 PM
Post #32120 - In reply to #32119

Mel, Thomas

I upped (or rather EZ Ed upped - Black Friday extra) my hard drive to 1 tb and Ram to 32. All other specs as before. So I think I am on the right path. Laptop has been ordered and we will if there is any holdups at the border or duties to be paid

Thanks all for help

James
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THOMAS HELGET

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Subject : RE: Choice of a fast PC to shorten OT calculation
Posted : 11/30/2022 12:44 PM
Post #32121 - In reply to #32120

James:

Good for you - I am sure you are on the right path and will be happy with your purchase as I was a couple of years ago. Note that it might be a while until you are in receipt of your computer - as I recall mine might have taken a little over a week to arrive and I am not sure what crossing the American/Canadian border entails these days.

I hope I helped, and I am sure Mel's extensive description did as well.
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