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ATM
Resilient ATM method
Last Activity 4/21/2021 9:48 AM
12 replies, 837 viewings

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Buffalo Bill

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Subject : Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/19/2020 7:41 AM
Post #46963

Looks interesting.

Go to checkout but no club discount?
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EYEGUY

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/19/2020 8:12 AM
Post #46965 - In reply to #46963

Buffalo:

Yep, looks like full price to one and all.

Tom
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mholstius

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/19/2020 6:28 PM
Post #46972 - In reply to #46965

Hmmm…
Don’t mean to offend anyone, but with those kinds of returns it still looks like an outstanding deal to me…
Wish we’d had it last month - and I’m definitely going to be using it from here on out.
Anything that can decrease anxiety is a good thing these days.
Mark

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Don Schuman

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/19/2020 8:36 PM
Post #46975 - In reply to #46963

I am looking for the information that started this thread. I did not receive a flyer or any email.

Can someone enlighten me?

Don
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jpb

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/19/2020 8:42 PM
Post #46976 - In reply to #46975

It was a email brochure that pointed to this web page for order of an Resilient ATM method similar to what you will find on OmniFunds.
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Buffalo Bill

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/20/2020 8:25 AM
Post #46979 - In reply to #46965

Tom

I've seen this before where they meant to give us our discount but the checkout page was messed up
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Buffalo Bill

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/20/2020 9:32 AM
Post #46986 - In reply to #46979

In this case no discount for club members because it's being done under a different LLC - omnivest intl. ATM stuff is under that

No soup for you
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jpb

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/20/2020 10:23 AM
Post #46988 - In reply to #46986

I kind of agree with Mark... Even without a club discount, the price looks reasonable for the performance.

I activated the Resilient OmniFund against one of my accounts 2 weeks ago and the account is up about 3%. I didn't activate it in time to catch the big run up day (it wasn't released yet). I know this isn't exactly the same as the ATM method but I understand they have the same fundamental design.

There is another thread about creating your own version with ATM. Tom H. and I went back and forth to see if we could create something similar. We didn't know at the time that OVI was going to release a method. At best, we could beat OmniFund's with leverage but fell short with the drawdown. Taking leverage out of the picture, neither of us came close.

I don't know how the ATM version compares to the OmniFund version (a number of different capabilities between OmniFund and ATM) but with all the research that went into it, the price looks reasonable to me.
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edahlb

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/20/2020 10:47 AM
Post #46991 - In reply to #46963

Question: Why is it so hard to duplicate in ATM? if you own the fund now, you have access to the symbol lists, definition of market states, rankers and allocations. It appears to me all it would take is a strategy with a VB system to handle trading on Mondays, with some smarts to handle holidays. What am I missing?

Stay safe everyone.
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Diamondjag

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/20/2020 10:50 AM
Post #46992 - In reply to #46991

Was wondering the same thing.
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jpb

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/20/2020 11:09 AM
Post #46993 - In reply to #46991

If you have access to the fund now, why wouldn't you just use it on OmniFunds? Why recreate the wheel? I think the ATM offering is for those who chose not to go the OmniFund route.

Why is it so hard to duplicate? Here's the link to a first pass (without looking too closely at OmniFunds). Both Tom and I cheated by looking at the lists for our final results.

And as Ed has said for years, lists make a difference. This is certainly true with the Resilient OmniFund.

I don't have the official ATM version to compare that thread with what I did in my experiments. But in constructing my experiment, I found it difficult to manage allocations and vary the allocation. Yes, I found an approach to do that but it wasn't straight forward.

List management and when to apply a specific list or effectively multiple lists also wasn't as straight forward. I may have over complicated it, but that's my nature.

And as you pointed out, calendar management on when to run the analysis and when to close the position also is a challenge. I didn't solve that.

The last area where I noticed differences that I don't know how I'd accomplish it with ATM is simply the adding or subtracting from a position without closing out the whole position. For instance, I observed OmniFunds decrease and increase the position for DOG without closing it completely and reopening the new position size.

Having said this, I did notice an enhancement to PR2I that just came out with a new allocation setting for concurrent market states that may answer my allocation challenge, but I suspect it wouldn't resolve the full problem without an additional market state or two.

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EYEGUY

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/20/2020 12:11 PM
Post #46995 - In reply to #46993

jpb:

With all the concerns you have so nicely detailed and your knowledge of the problem and its possible imperfect solutions, don't you wonder If Nirvana Systems has accurately duplicated OmniFunds Resilient?

I know I do.

Now ATM Resilient might be a better animal but I can't see how it can duplicate OmniFunds Resilient in my own mind.

Tom Helget
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jpb

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Subject : RE: Resilient ATM method
Posted : 4/20/2020 12:24 PM
Post #46997 - In reply to #46995

Tom,

I agree with you. While I haven't seen the ATM method version, is suspect that the OmniFunds Resilient is a step above. But for those who don't want to go the OmniFunds route, I think the ATM version will be very helpful in this market.

Jeff B
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